RE: [rp-ml] ProJet 3000 input?

From: John Vegher <>
Date: Thu Apr 05 2012 - 19:26:06 EEST

Hi Jeremy,


Thanks for your input.


I'm certainly not one that goes in for any marketing flash. I take
everything that sellers/resellers say with a heaping pile of salt. The only
way to figure out anything about these machines is to talk to users. Which
is why I asked the question here.


Do you mind if I ask which Envisiontec machine you're running?


We use the Objet Eden 500v here and it is a definite workhorse. And it is
great for larger parts. But it's build lines just don't work for smaller,
organic parts. That is, the parts require hand finishing before molding.




From: Jeremy Pullin []
Sent: Thursday, April 05, 2012 2:06 AM
To: Lino P. Stavole; Mullen, John;;
Subject: RE: [rp-ml] ProJet 3000 input?




Firstly don't believe the marketing bullshit and flashy Envisiontec videos
saying how their systems build pixel by pixel rather than layer by layer
thus eliminating build lines. We run a Perfactory here and the build lines
are less noticeable than some of the other technologies we use but they are
still there. You can build using either 25 micron layers or 50 so building
with the thinner 25 micron layers will help.


You say that you're looking at getting 'another' high res machine from which
I draw the assumption that you already have one. John Makes a good point
about the skill level required with a perfactory so it will make a
difference is this is the system that you are currently using as you will
already have this expertise. Failing that it does take quite a while and
lots of wasted builds before you finally manage to 'tame' the system.


Depending on the resolution you're looking for, Objet could be an option but
despite even thinner layers (16 microns) the build lines are if anything
more visible than the EnvisionTec's this is because the layers may be thin
which looks impressive on the specification but the alignment between layers
is not sufficiently controlled meaning that side walls end up as rough and
uneven as my mother in-law's chin.


Good luck.




From: [] On Behalf
Of Lino P. Stavole
Sent: 04 April 2012 23:37
To: 'Mullen, John';;
Subject: RE: [rp-ml] ProJet 3000 input?


Well, if anyone has the skills John does. It was my understanding that
perfactory was working on algorithms to "blur" the buildlines or bridge them
so to speak. I remember reading somewhere that the buildlines were still
there but less obvious. I do not know if the changes were just tests,
implemented or what.

I was able to play around with a projet and remember that parts were nice
but there was still noticeable buildlines based on orientation.


Just my 2cents


From: [] On Behalf
Of Mullen, John
Sent: Wednesday, April 04, 2012 1:10 PM
Subject: RE: [rp-ml] ProJet 3000 input?


I'd offer your customers what they want, the resolution/surface finish of
the Perfactory Multi Mini with ERM surpasses all other technologies. A
possible downside is you will need a higher level of skill to do it



From: [] On Behalf
Of John Vegher
Sent: Wednesday, April 04, 2012 1:39 PM
Subject: [rp-ml] ProJet 3000 input?




We're looking at adding another high resolution machine here at Moddler.
We've been looking at both ProJet and Perfactory printers to better service
our customers who create small models with copious amounts of detail and
want output free of build lines. Most of our customers prefer Perfactory
output due to the high resolution and superior surface quality.


But I wonder if our customers prefer Perfactoy output because there are more
Perfactory bureaus than ProJet bureaus. It's a chicken/egg question: do
service bureaus not use ProJets because there is no demand or is there no
demand because service bureaus don't offer ProJet parts? Are companies
gunshy about buying the successor to the Invision printers? Or are there
other reasons?


I would be very grateful for any input you have. And I'm happy to receive
your comments directly.



John Vegher

Principal and Founder of  <> Moddler 
2325 Third Street, Suite 342 San Francisco, CA 94107 
415.252.1063 |  <>
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Received on Thu Apr 05 19:21:57 2012

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